1) Glorify me with the Glory I had with thee, John 17:5

We have been asked to comment on this passage. As always we explore the context. In this case the passage comes from a prayer containing a plea made by our Lord to his Father. The context and prayer from the perspective of Hebrew thought shows strong connections to the Old Testament.

The last night and his Struggle

John's record has a lot of detail of what was said by Y'shua on the night before the crucifixion. These are the words of a man who knew he was to die, and shortly was to sweat like great drops of blood struggling against his desire that the “cup be taken from him” (Luke 22:44). Yet at this time and afterwards Y'shua is calm and steadfast.

Y'shua says clearly, and most likely not in Greek, but Hebrew, 'I am going to my Father' (John 16:10). He knows his disciples don't understand he must die and that they will deny him and so he frankly says, “I have yet many things to tell you, but you cannot hear them” (John 16:12). In context he means they cannot understand them at that time, and they did not understand until he explained how he had to suffer in the scriptures after his resurrection.

He then says, “all things that my Father has are mine” (John 16:15). He then goes on to speak of a point that many leaders in his nation denied. Despite the witness of his birth, the Pharisees in the Temple said this to his face,

“We be not born of fornication; we have one Father, even God.” (John 8:41)

Y'shua underlines his miraculous birth again saying, “I came out from the Father, and have come into the world (kosmos, this order): again I leave the world (kosmos, this order) and am going to my Father.” (16:28). The disciples understand that point. They are convinced. They know of the events surrounding his birth and have seen the evidence of the miracles. But very few understand the implications of what Jesus means by “all things that my father has are mine” in context of his own name.

'All Things that my Father has – are mine' – 'ask in my Name'

Christianity often misses a fundamental point, and so misses a key point Y'shua (and John his scribe) are making. Three times, Y'shua speaks of “my name” (16:23,24,&26). Three times means it is very important. He says something that ought to be a shock.

Hitherto have ye asked nothing in my name: ask, and ye shall receive, that your joy may be full. (John 16:24)

They have been going about healing, using Y'shua's name, or “in his name”. This is implied when they are sent out two by two to spread Y'shua's name (Mark 6) and also it is said directly,

Jesus said, “Forbid him not: for there is no man which shall do a miracle in my name, that can lightly speak evil of me.” (Mark 9:39)

The implication is logically and in context that Y'shua, in going to his father, will change something about his name. It has a new significance. To get what Y'shua is speaking of we need to think like a Jew.

The Name

Jews will speak of 'the name' or 'hashem'. The name speaks of great things. They, like the prophets and writers of the Old Testament, mention the name in a striking way,

Neither shall ye profane my holy name; but I will be hallowed among the children of Israel: I am the LORD which hallow you, (Leviticus 22:32)

It does not say they shall not profane God, but his name! What this means is more easily grasped from the command regarding the Levites,

For the LORD thy God has chosen him out of all thy tribes, to stand to minister in the name of the LORD, him and his sons for ever. (Deuteronomy 18:5)

They were not chosen to minster to God but to minister in the Name! They teach on behalf of, and regarding the name of God. There is a curious expression regarding the dwelling place over the ark.

And David arose, and went with all the people that were with him from Baale of Judah, to bring up from thence the ark of God, whose name is called by the name of the LORD of hosts that dwells between the cherubims. (2Sa 6:2)

And again,

Only the people sacrificed in high places, because there was no house built unto the name of the LORD, until those days. (1Kings 3:2)

The Hebrews did not say God dwelt there but rather the name dwelt there. They did not say the temple was built to God but to his Name. This is an important point for otherwise there is a contradiction. Paul puts is clearly,

Howbeit the most High dwells not in temples made with hands; as saith the prophet, Heaven is my throne, and earth is my footstool: what house will ye build me? saith the Lord: or what is the place of my rest? (Acts 7:48-49)

'Hashem' or 'The name' is not used interchangeably with God and is used in a specific way, indicating it is not speaking of Deity himself. We need to go to Hebrew to see what the Hebrew name for 'the LORD' means to see what they understood and what Y'shua was getting at. It's not hard.

And Moses said unto God, Behold, when I come unto the children of Israel, and shall say unto them, The God of your fathers has sent me unto you; and they shall say to me, What is his name? what shall I say unto them? (Exodus 3:13)

In Hebrew the reply was

אהיה אשׁר אהיה

The words are in adjacent verses and are translated for us, as their meaning dictates Exodus 3:12 begins

ויאמר כי ־ אהיה עמך

And he said, Certainly I will be with thee.

The other word appears in Exodus 3:9

אשׁר מצרים לחצים אתם

wherewith (or with which) the Egyptians oppress them.

To be consistent with all other translations of these two simple Hebrew words 3:14 might best begin

“I will be wherewith (or with who) I will be”, or the name “He will be”, Yahweh.

This is consistent with a Jewish understanding of the way the world has been created as a purposeful ongoing work, where so often the prophets declare that Deity proclaims events “shall” occur. Thus Hashem is about what He (Diety) shall do. The presence of Deity is not to be confused with the action of Deity. Thought not the same in analogy, our body and mind as physical existence (a noun) is different from our actions (a verb). A Jewish Hebrew teacher put it well. He said that Jews when writing of God's actions used future perfect as if the action though future already existed, because, unlike humans, it was sure to occur. Having established that the name of the Father is “I will be with-who I will be”, or perhaps “I will dwell with who I will”, we may then see that the name of the son, Y'shua, was to have a similar role.

The name of Y'shua (Jesus)

All Jewish names have a meaning and this name was to become powerful after Y'shua went to his Father. The name Y'shua means “Yah shall save”.

This point is clear, Christians understand it was after the death and resurrection that people may be saved. Only in this may we be saved. But they miss a point, we are not justified in Jesus himself, but in his name

And such were some of you: but ye are washed, but ye are sanctified, but ye are justified in the name of the Lord Jesus, and by the Spirit of our God. (1Cor 6:11)

According to Y'shua and the Apostles, Christians are not baptised into Jesus, but in his name,

When they heard this, they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus. (Act 19:5 cp 8:16, 10:48))

The Bible does not waste one word. The name of the Lord Y'shua is very important. Paul even in an aside uses the same terms,

Unto the church of God which is at Corinth, to them that are sanctified in Christ Jesus, called to be saints, with all that in every place call upon the name of Jesus Christ our Lord, both theirs and ours: (1Co 1:2)

And whatsoever you do in word or deed, do all in the name of the Lord Jesus, giving thanks to God and the Father by him. (Colossians 3:17)

As the children of Israel called on the name of Yahweh, so the early Christians called on the name of Y'shua (Yah/ he will save) the Anointed. James speaks in similar terms and connects the two,

Simeon has declared how God at the first did visit the Gentiles, to take out of them a people for his name. And to this agree the words of the prophets; as it is written, After this I will return, and will build again the tabernacle of David, which is fallen down; and I will build again the ruins thereof, and I will set it up: That the residue of men might seek after the Lord, and all the Gentiles, upon whom my name is called, saith the Lord, who does all these things. Known unto God are all his works from the beginning of the world. (Acts 15:14-18)

James says that when people are baptised into the name of Jesus then they became known as the people “upon whom” the name of Yahweh “is called”. James quotes Amos, and extrapolates that Amos speaks of things known by God from the beginning of the Kosmos or this order of things. This is an important point. God knew all his works form the beginning.

'I have overcome this order of things' yet Y'shua pleads for help

At the end of Y'shua's communication with his disciples as recorded by John, after the passover meal Y'shua said, in a projection of his intent, that they were to “be of good courage, for I have overcome this order of things (kosmos)” (16:33). In this context where “all things that my Father has - are mine” (John 16:15), and of the new position of Y'shua's name, John shares with us the highly personal prayer, the communication, of Y'shua to his Father.

It begins with a powerful plea requesting Yahweh's glory.

“Father the hour is come: glorify thy son that the son may glorify thee”

What a plea! One can feel the emotion, as he seeks help. He has overcome so far but yet needs more help to finish his course. We know this as he has yet to sweat great drops like blood. Y'shua and his disciples were soaked in the words of the Torah, and the idea of Glory. It was the Glory of Yahweh that came down in the cloud and in-folding fire that dwelt on Mt Sinai (Exodus 24:16), The fire, cloud and thunder concealing the presence of the Glory must not be mistaken for the Glory,

And the LORD said unto Moses, “Lo, I come unto thee in a thick cloud, that the people may hear when I speak with thee, and believe thee for ever.” (Exodus 19:9)

It was Moses who asked to see or understand the Glory, and who then heard the Name in full,

And Yahweh descended in the cloud, and stood with him there, and proclaimed the name of Yahweh. And the LORD passed by before him, and proclaimed, “He who will be He who will be Strength, merciful and gracious, longsuffering, and abundant in goodness and truth, Keeping mercy for thousands, forgiving iniquity and transgression and sin, and that will by no means clear the guilty; visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children, and upon the children's children, unto the third and to the fourth generation.” (Exodus 34:5-7)

This is the same Glory Y'shua was requesting. He was about to become the means by which people were forgiven iniquity transgression and sin. We can know this as his supplication continues speaking of his ability, though the authority granted him, to give age-lasting (aionian) life.

Y'shua then looks back and says to his Father “he has finished the work” he was given, but then adds a bit which many be missed “that I should do it.” Some translations miss it. This is word for word translation from Nestle,

I thee glorified on the earth, the work finishing which thou hast given to me that I should do it

This fits with the way one might think as a Hebrew in Hebrew, that one is doing something continually on an ongoing basis, to then reach the end of doing it. As yet he had not reached the end. His desired end is said after the conjunction, connecting the thought,

I thee glorified on the earth, the work finishing which thou have given to me that I should do it and now glorify thou me, Father, with thyself with the glory which I had before the (existed) the world (Kosmos) to be with thee. I manifested of thee the name to the men whom thou gave me out of the world. To thee they were to me them thou gave, and the word of thee they have kept. (John 17:4-6)

This is an expansion of the opening of his supplication to his Father. He is asking for the Glory of the name “thyself” which is “to be” in the future “with thee.” This prayer that he be glorified, indicates he did not have this glory. It was a prayer/ plea/ request that he be strengthened in what he was to do, and more than that that after his obedience unto death, he would be raised to glory, the firstfruits from the dead (1 Cor 15:20).

Remember that Y'shua says he desires at that time in the upper room this glory he had in the context where “all things that my Father has - are (now) mine” (16:15). This Glory Y'shua had (as he now has all his Father's things) before this order of things existed.

This order of things in Adam

To us this may sound odd, but the Hebrew Bible is full of people speaking of things in the future as if they are certain. Before we find out what occurred before this order of things existed, we need to know what order of things exists now! Isn't this world's order one where suffering, sin and death exist? We are told by James that it is common knowledge that Yahweh knew his plan from the beginning. What Glory was there before this order of sin and death? What is written of events before Adam's sin? What was the intent of creating humans?

And God said, “Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creeps upon the earth.” So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them. (Genesis 1:26-27)

It is a fact that the record has Y'shua very rarely saying he is the son of God, yet he says 80 times he is the 'Son of man'. In Hebrew the word for man is 'Adam'. The glory the son of man had at the beginning was that man (Adam) was created in the image of God. Then he sinned. Finally the second Adam has given us all an inheritance which allows us once again to show forth the image of God, or as Y'shua says 'manifest the name', becoming a fulfilment of God's plan.

And so it is written, The first man Adam was made a living soul; the last Adam was made a quickening spirit. (1Corinthians 15:45)

To the end that,

he must reign, till he has put all enemies under his feet. The last enemy that shall be destroyed is death. For he hath put all things under his feet. But when he says all things are put under him, it is manifest that he is excepted, which did put all things under him. And when all things shall be subdued unto him, then shall the Son also himself be subject unto him that put all things under him, that God may be all in all. (1Corinthians 15:25-28)

And when this occurs finally the end plan, the plan made from the beginning in the creation of the first son of man, will be complete in the unity in conformity to the perfect image of all the sons of man, and then the intent of the name of He who will be who he will be, will finally be-come the Glory spoken of in the Torah,

But as truly as I live, all the earth shall be filled with the glory of the LORD. (Numbers 14:21)

In summary

This last prayer in the upper room made by our Lord is a powerful call for help to overcome as the son of Adam and be given the Glory in resurrection intended from the beginning, that all other sons of Adam may found in the image of God, as Deity's name proclaims “forgiving iniquity and transgression and sin,” in his own name of Yah-shall-Save. The prayer was answered as due to the subsequent events,

Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved. (Acts 4:12)

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